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OvalAutos
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Member Since: 02 Jan 2019
Location: Cradley Heath
Posts: 96

United Kingdom 
Warrantywise - Help Needed

Dear forum friends,

I'm looking for any assistance is dealing with Warrantywise. As usual for us, we've got a customer car with a snapped crankshaft. It's typical lovely clean snap with no bearing failures and the oil pump looks in good condition. The only other issue is that #3 main bearing cap is not a tight (interference) fit in the block, which again is not unusual. No spun bearings.



The engineer, lovely chap Graham from Liverpool, came out to assess the damage and confirmed it was a sudden failure of the crankshaft and didn't see any issues.

Warrantywise have come back with the following;

I regret to inform you that on this occasion your repair has been declined.
Your repairer wishes to replace the following part(s) on your vehicle:
1) Engine
We instructed an independent vehicle examiner to assess your vehicle who has confirmed.
In our opinion based on the visible evidence we would conclude that we can confirm that the
crankshaft was snapped. We consider this is a result of material failure. This is a known concern
on this type of engine.
The engine fitted to this vehicle is the TDV6 and is the subject of a Land Rover technical bulletin
which reports crank shaft failures,bearing failures,engine seizures and knocking engines.
Unfortunately the plan excludes common occurring and well documented issues as per page 19
(f3.17) of the plan document.


I've heard that some members have had direct communication with Warrantywise and written conformation that snapped cranks are covered. Does anybody have such a communication and can I get a copy?

I'm not trying to stiff the company, but if this is true, then they should not be selective on who they will give cover to based on someone taking the initiative and getting it in writing.

As you can imagine, my customer not very happy and I'm trying to get as much info together before going back to the company. So any help or thoughts would be much appreciated.

Copying this to DISCO3/4 as well.

Many thanks... .

Joe

Those in the know, know. Those that don't know, just need to ask.
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Post #611857 Thu Mar 25 2021 8:28am
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Disco_Mikey



Member Since: 08 Apr 2012
Location: Dundee, Scotland
Posts: 3891

United Kingdom 

Ask them to confirm which TSB/SSM confirmed this to be a "known manufacturing defect" Thumbs Up

The only one I an aware of is an "enhanced" customer handling procedure in the event of an engine failure

BTW, WarrantyWise are a shower of Censored to deal with

Post #611860 Thu Mar 25 2021 8:39am
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Disco_Mikey



Member Since: 08 Apr 2012
Location: Dundee, Scotland
Posts: 3891

United Kingdom 

Quote:
DG wrote:
Appeared today

Quote:
Reference SSM71816

Models

Discovery 4 / L319
Discovery 3 / L319
Range Rover / L405
Range Rover Sport / L494
Range Rover Sport / L320

Title Crankshaft/Crankshaft Bearing Concerns - TDv6 Diesel Engine
Category Engine
Last modified 06-May-2014 00:00:00
Symptom 499000 Basic Engine

Content
Issue:
Crankshaft/crankshaft bearing failure - TDv6 Diesel Engine.
Cause:
Low incidence of crankshaft failure are being encountered, caused mainly by incorrect location of the main bearing shells during assembly, or through rotation of the shells during normal use. A new procedure has been implemented to ensure:
- more rapid resolution of customer concerns, and
- greater visibility of failure modes in order to improve repair process and parts delivery.

Action:
For any suspected crankshaft/bearing failure, please contact your local Dealer Technical Supportor FRED team for details of the enhanced customer handling procedure.
The list below summarises typical symptoms of crankshaft/bearing failure, but please contact your DTS/FRED team if in any doubt as they will be pleased to offer assistance:
· Crankshaft is seized, engine cannot be turned either via starter motor or crankshaft pulley bolt.
· Oil sump or engine cylinder block is holed, with oil leakage and/or metallic debris found on engine under-tray.
· Engine makes a loud ‘rumbling/knocking’ sound when running which worsens as the engine is placed under load. The engine oil pressure warning light may flash or be continuously illuminated, especially at low engine speeds.

Post #611861 Thu Mar 25 2021 8:44am
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RRSTDV8



Member Since: 13 Aug 2011
Location: Northamptonshire
Posts: 7586

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Sport SDV6 HSE Orkney Grey

Isn't this just the use of a "weasel words" phrase to get out of paying? Crankshaft failure isn't common nor is it exactly well documented (outside of scare stories in online forums). It has been suggested that a chat with the insurance ombudsman might help grease the wheels - they don't like the use of weasel words to get out of paying. 2012 SDV6 - it's missing a couple of cylinders
2008 TDV8 - it was a labour of love and is much missed

Post #611865 Thu Mar 25 2021 10:59am
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OvalAutos
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Member Since: 02 Jan 2019
Location: Cradley Heath
Posts: 96

United Kingdom 

Found a post on disco3/4 saying they had an email from WW saying they would cover the crank.

https://www.disco3.co.uk/forum/warranty-cr...rrantywise .

Joe

Those in the know, know. Those that don't know, just need to ask.
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Post #611867 Thu Mar 25 2021 11:32am
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OvalAutos
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Member Since: 02 Jan 2019
Location: Cradley Heath
Posts: 96

United Kingdom 

Update from Warrantywise...

So long as your engine is the TDV6 mentioned above, then Land Rover have acknowledged that this is a manufacturing defect, and should have some liability for repair.

Does anyone have any known faults that JLR have acknowledged, that have been paid out to repair under third party warranty? I need to put an example to them to catch them out.

Also, when did JLR actually acknowledge the crankshaft issue as a manufacturing defect? Surely if they had, the flood gates would be open for claims against them. .

Joe

Those in the know, know. Those that don't know, just need to ask.
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Post #611877 Thu Mar 25 2021 4:53pm
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RRSTDV8



Member Since: 13 Aug 2011
Location: Northamptonshire
Posts: 7586

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Sport SDV6 HSE Orkney Grey

Surely it is for WarrantyWise to provide evidence to back up their position? If they wish to show that the claim isn't valid for a given reason, they need to demonstrate that reason. Just saying "JLR have acknowledged" isn't any evidence. 2012 SDV6 - it's missing a couple of cylinders
2008 TDV8 - it was a labour of love and is much missed

Post #611878 Thu Mar 25 2021 5:17pm
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Dave-t



Member Since: 18 Jan 2020
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 309

United Kingdom 

A long time ago I had a warrantywise warranty that refused to pay out for a replacement engine, disco mikey was heavily involved in this process. I found an e mail to Quentin Willson got an almost instant response of a phone call from the MD. whilst it didn’t get a payout for the engine I did get far more progress than I did from the no department. Afraid I can’t remember how I found his e mail address though, and I’ve wiped everything from that sorry episode 2015 RRS autobiography Corris Grey/Black roof
1994 Defender 90 300 tdi

2016 Disco 4 graphite
2012 Disco 4 XS
2005 Disco 3 S

Post #611883 Thu Mar 25 2021 6:30pm
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Disco_Mikey



Member Since: 08 Apr 2012
Location: Dundee, Scotland
Posts: 3891

United Kingdom 

RRSTDV8 wrote:
Surely it is for WarrantyWise to provide evidence to back up their position? If they wish to show that the claim isn't valid for a given reason, they need to demonstrate that reason. Just saying "JLR have acknowledged" isn't any evidence.


This Thumbs Up

If they say its a known issue, ask them to provide evidence of such

Post #611890 Thu Mar 25 2021 9:38pm
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syl



Member Since: 10 Mar 2016
Location: Somerset
Posts: 379

United Kingdom 

Would be nice to get this sorted. Either it’s an issue, in which case JLR are on the hook (to the first owner at least) for selling unfit goods or it’s not, in which case the warranty company are.

I think I’d start with the insurance ombudsman and then you’ll have to consider the courts. If JLR don’t agree I’m sure they’ll not be happy with warrantywise badmouthing them either, so why don’t you ask them for comment publicly via Twitter or Facebook. RRS MY17 SDV6 AB
Evoque MY17 TD4 AB

Post #611900 Fri Mar 26 2021 8:17am
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OvalAutos
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Member Since: 02 Jan 2019
Location: Cradley Heath
Posts: 96

United Kingdom 

Still waiting for a asking for the JLR document that acknowledges the crankshaft problem is a manufacturing problem. They did however send this, which we all know about already.

Reference SSM71816

Models

Discovery 4 / L319
Discovery 3 / L319
Range Rover / L405
Range Rover Sport / L494
Range Rover Sport / L320

Title Crankshaft/Crankshaft Bearing Concerns - TDv6 Diesel Engine
Category Engine
Last modified 06-May-2014 00:00:00
Symptom 499000 Basic Engine

Content
Issue:
Crankshaft/crankshaft bearing failure - TDv6 Diesel Engine.
Cause:
Low incidence of crankshaft failure are being encountered, caused mainly by incorrect location of the main bearing shells during assembly, or through rotation of the shells during normal use. A new procedure has been implemented to ensure:
- more rapid resolution of customer concerns, and
- greater visibility of failure modes in order to improve repair process and parts delivery.

Action:
For any suspected crankshaft/bearing failure, please contact your local Dealer Technical Support or FRED team for details of the enhanced customer handling procedure.
The list below summarises typical symptoms of crankshaft/bearing failure, but please contact your DTS/FRED team if in any doubt as they will be pleased to offer assistance:
a· Crankshaft is seized, engine cannot be turned either via starter motor or crankshaft pulley bolt.
b· Oil sump or engine cylinder block is holed, with oil leakage and/or metallic debris found on engine under-tray.
c· Engine makes a loud rumbling/knocking sound when running which worsens as the engine is placed under load. The engine oil pressure warning light may flash or be continuously illuminated, especially at low engine speeds.


I responded to this one with the fact that the engine is a G2 and has tabbed bearings for correct alignment and there was no bearing damage as noted by their engineer. .

Joe

Those in the know, know. Those that don't know, just need to ask.
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Post #611909 Fri Mar 26 2021 10:18am
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BigBen



Member Since: 15 Dec 2015
Location: Hertfordshire
Posts: 88

United Kingdom 

Email quentin@quentinwillson.co.uk

from his website

Post #611913 Fri Mar 26 2021 10:57am
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pjbracer1



Member Since: 25 Aug 2014
Location: Southampton
Posts: 336

England 

Stragne I was curious on this as mine is having a 7yr service for the belts so thatouhg id ask LR headoffice to see what they say about it.

The said that SSM71816 Is not an SSM that Land Rover as a manufacturer have open and as such is not a relevant reference.

I thouhgt I would ask them as my paranoia got the better of me and when I was reversing down a lane I thought I coud hear a ticking noise from the engine mroe than normal! I started it back the next day and the engine sounds fine.

Just curious if this SSM is still available, I looked on Topix so maybe this wasnt for the publics eyes, hence them replyin to me saying its not a current SSM

All in all I think its really poor that they cant recognise the fault as the reality is if its poor desgin or workmanship Im surprised all of the warranty claims made havent been collected and reviewed. by a 3rd party to make a mass claim or something. If a jobs worth doing, get a someone who knows what they are doing to do it!

RRS Autobiography Indus
RRS Supercharged Santorini
AMG CLK Rear Tyre Shredder

Post #613522 Tue May 11 2021 4:00pm
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