If you can listen to the radio at the moment, Jeremy Vine on Radio 2 is about to have a discussion around 4x4s... expect the usual Robin Sunflower types..... 

shmoogle - did you listen and if so was it a dig at us?  RRS 2.7 TDV6 HSE Zambezi silver,Alpaca.
On Order - LRX expected 2010
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I listened too it - complete load of TOSH

I also spent 3 minutes typing in a reply on the forum - went to add something hit the wrong key and hey presto all text wiped clean -

But here goes again :-

For a start off they claim the 4x4 has no purpose unless half way up a mountain? Too big/heavy/uneconomical/not eco friendly.... etc

Then a chap phones in and blathers on about a poor girl who was knocked down by one ( its bad whatever the car ). He said he was a witness to a women driving a 4x4 near a school ( she wasnt on the school run ) and was reversing out of a spot when the child ran behind her. Now is that the fault of the 4x4 ? Ok its big and heavy so the girl may have been better of if she'd been hit by a SMART car? I dont know. But if they want to talk about weight.................

New Range Rover Supercharged 2632kg
My own Sport 2572kg
Disco 3 2419kg


A Chrysler Grand Voyager weighs 2150kg

A top spec Mercedes S65AMG weighs 2220kg


And if you drive round London ( which they refered to a lot ) for heavens sake you see as many Rolls Royces at 2485kg and even more Bentley's at 2410kg for the GT and a whacking 2655kg for the Anarge


Ban the Maybach they weigh between 2735kg - 2855kg

Now let me see .... what do all these do to the gallon & what would happen if one was to reverse over you

The debate is endless

They say in defence that Trucks , VANS, Buses,Trains etc all have a purpose, so are exempt? How is this... a truck -bus -train can offload its goods/passengers and seek a smaller method of transport for the final leg of their journey. So get them out of the city as well !

It just doesnt work/stack up.

For ***k sake get real.

What they really want is for LR to die & mass unemployment for all those who work there and the associated peripheral workers.
Add to this what will we all buy instead when they ban the 4x4

Lets all buy an Old Routemaster London Bus - because there ok !!!!!!!!!!! 
" WITH MORE EXTRAS THAN A HOLLYWOOD EPIC "

Yes, it didn't really amount to much more that the usual rubbishing of 4x4s. The whole thing was defended by a woman who ran some anti-4x4 establishment - Alliance Against Urban 4x4s, I think (put me in mind of the old People's Front of Judea/Judean People's Front thing from Monty Python, esp as Jeremy Vine kept calling it the wrong thing). This is the organisation who put these fake parking tickets on your windscreen "advising" of your poor choice of car.

Basically she was saying 4x4s are bad because if you get hit by one you will die, the world will come to an end because of emissions/fuel usage etc, all the usual stuff. She was planning to lobby govt over increasing the amount of tax that 4x4 owners should pay, increasing the CC for 4x4 drivers in the centre of London, banning them in other urban areas etc. She was also trying to get across the point that a 4x4 is completely unsuitable for travelling around in cities. A point that she never really supported with anything in my view. OK, so you might agree that her points re safety/environmental aspects were at least semi-supportable but apparently this also makes them unusable in urban areas. I've driven through plenty of urban areas in mine thanks and I didn't have a problem.

Example of her lack of grasp of the whole thing was when she was expounding on how dangerous they are for other road users. In her world, it seems that all crashes are caused by 4x4s and that most 4x4 drivers choose to drive into Minis, thus wiping out their passengers. JV mentioned that maybe people drive 4x4s because the feel they protect their kids whilst transporting them around for this very reason? Her answer? Well, if everyone drove small cars then all the accidents would be small-scale and your kids would be fine.... she herself rides a pushbike - 10/10 for road safety there then.

All credit for standing up on the radio to state your case, but I can't see how she's done much to evangelise her cause by being on that show today. 

It is all crazy talk and I was thinking today when I was in the car.

A Range Rover of any denomination is built in BRITAIN by UK workers and using many parts that come from other UK companies made by UK Workers. Should we not be supporting UK business?

Now, they say we should all go and buy foreign small boring cheaper to run Eddy-Punch-clock type cars instead as they are safer and more economical etc, but a lot of them are shipped into the UK by truck, boat, plane, you name it, the transport costs of getting some of these cars to our shores surely outweighs the 4x4 fuel consumption.

I bet Tim could tell us how much fuel a container ship consumes getting from Japan/Korea to the UK. They don't mention THAT type of Polution do they?

why? Because they are simple jealous people, they can't afford one so they bitch at people who have, this country is turning communist!

Why don't they complain about the number of estate cars on the road? They take up the same amount of road space as a 4x4 and cause the same amount of congestion. Why don't they complain about supercars like Ferraris, Porsche etc etc, they are not very economical either...will we ban those?

When ARE they going to see that the people who buy these cars, the people with the money, are the people keeping this country going!

I despair, this place has gone to the dogs, last one to leave, switch the lights off.. Now: Range Rover Vogue TD6, JE Stage 1. (Green!)

*Gone: Range Rover Sport Supercharged 4.2V8 (Silver)
*Gone: BMW M5 5.0V8 (Silver)
*Gone: Subaru Imprezza Turbo (Silver)

Quote:

4x4 drivers choose to drive into Minis, thus wiping out their passengers

Quote:

Her answer? Well, if everyone drove small cars then all the accidents would be small-scale

yes, you can always go back and listen again, you need Realplayer though.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio2/index.shtml?logo Now: Range Rover Vogue TD6, JE Stage 1. (Green!)

*Gone: Range Rover Sport Supercharged 4.2V8 (Silver)
*Gone: BMW M5 5.0V8 (Silver)
*Gone: Subaru Imprezza Turbo (Silver)

Here's one for our Disco friends.

One smart car = 2 people. One Disco 3 = 7 people. How many Smart cars do you need to carry the same amount as a Disco 3? If my maths is correct the answer is 4, times that by the Smart cars footrint and emissions and what is the answer? I'm sure the Disco wins! RRS 2.7 TDV6 HSE Zambezi silver,Alpaca.
On Order - LRX expected 2010
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shmoogle wrote:

- Alliance Against Urban 4x4s, I think (put me in mind of the old People's Front of Judea/Judean People's Front thing from Monty Python, esp as Jeremy Vine kept calling it the wrong thing). This is the organisation who put these fake parking tickets on your windscreen "advising" of your poor choice of car.

Quote:

10. and.......................................

I forgot - there is something good about a Fart car - it's perfect to put on my yacht when I'm burning fuel at 2mpg - I cann't get my RRS onboard! RRS 2.7 TDV6 HSE Zambezi silver,Alpaca.
On Order - LRX expected 2010
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OK, Tim's 2p about containerships that carry 10000 x 20 foot containers at a time. Per 24 hours at full speed for the latest ships burn 460 TONNES of heavy oil of which it is reckonned that 60 tonnes comes back out of the funnel every day as particulate and sulphuric acid. Now the passage from Tokyo to Southampton takes 22 days and the company I work for has 9 ships a week on the service between UK and Japan................................. all exactly the same.
And you sure as hell would not want your kiddies to be knocked down by one as they weigh in at some 140,000tonnes fully loaded and would pretty well wipe out a whole street if they hit something at speed - 140000t moving at 30mph means a lot of momentum!
Also think what happens when just one of those ships arrives in port and all those containers get unloaded and another lot get loaded........ all the trucks and trains needed to carry them, and do you know where most of that cargo is going? Well in the UK most of it is going to Honda, Toyota and Sony and the likes to build more poluters. We worry about FOODMILES what about "Japanese" CAR miles just to build them! A Carbon Footprint is the mark a lump of coal makes when it's dropped on the ground.

Tata TDv8 HSE - Stornoway/ebony and straight grain walnut with towpack, Tasmods and an HST grille. Coming soon LEDs in the headlights
Staying - Epsom Green Defender 90 for playing off road

Last edited by Tim in Scotland on Thu Nov 24 2005 7:12pm. Edited 1 time in total

This is great stuff....keep it coming, please

Do you wear organic footwear?

R4 2100/ 24th - how to stop ships polluting the atmosphere............ all the worlds shipping put together produces as much Sulphurdioxide and Nox as the whole of the USA....................... in a year A Carbon Footprint is the mark a lump of coal makes when it's dropped on the ground.

Tata TDv8 HSE - Stornoway/ebony and straight grain walnut with towpack, Tasmods and an HST grille. Coming soon LEDs in the headlights
Staying - Epsom Green Defender 90 for playing off road