As one who has just become an ex-RRS (but not an ex-Land Rover as I still have my 22 year old Defender) owner. it would be interesting to hear from those who have departed the brand/ model in the last 12-24 months (if they are still looking in to the forum) why they didn’t buy another Sport or even Land Rover product. If you are about to leave as well would be interesting to hear why.

I’ll start the ball rolling
1) the main reason I left the RRS on a BMW forecourt was over lack of any reassurance from dealers or JLR that the design issues (snapping cranks and oil dilution) with the V6 diesels would be repaired at no cost to me should the worst happen once the 3 year makers warranty ran out. To be told each case is looked at on a case by case basis is NOT re-assurance and not divulging if there is even a series of engine numbers / VINs affected is worrying, especially to private buyers like myself.

2) I feel that JLR are milking the brand for everything that they can and prices are now ludicrous. No longer are Land Rovers seen as expensive yet value for money cars. They are just seen as very expensive cars to buy and run.

3) While I have been lucky with this car (because it had been 3 years in production already when I bought mine) I have been an early adopter of new tech (I had one of the first Evoques fitted with InControl Remote and Secure and DPF monitors) from Land Rover in the past I would like to have replaced my Sport with either an RRS PHEV or a Jaguar I Pace but with the issues with ICTP and some issues already with the PHEV I just don’t want to go through all the frustrations, being told “they are all like that” “The technical department don’t yet have a fix for this so we don’ t know how long your car will,be off the road” etc etc are not what I want to hear form a maker who has allegedly spent millions and millions developing and testing new technology. I believe that this is causing JLR more lost customers than anything else.

4) Some Dealership staff,and it appears also LRCS and senior management, have absolutely no idea of customer courtesy or satisfaction preferring to ignore customers with issues, especially quality control issues - again it’s the “they are all like that” mentality where the customer gets the impression that nobody cares about their problems.

I am NOT a first time Land Rover purchaser, I am one of the very large group of purchasers of JLR products who have returned time and again to buy new vehicles even through the dark days of before BMW.......... but there is a limit to how much we will spend and to thevissues we will,put up with in new cars. 2020 Pangea Green 1st Edition D240 New Defender 110 is here and loving it
2018 Melting Silver Mini Countryman PHEV - soon to be replaced
2015MY Corris Grey SDv6 HSE Dynamic, the best car I have ever owned, totally reliable only a cou0le of rattles in 3 years, now no longer in my care
Also in my garage is a 1996 TDi300 Defender 90 County HT made into a fake CSW

Tim, I couldn’t agree more.

I sold my 2013 HSE Black RRS in Sept 2016 and went for a Discovery Sport with the intention of returning to the RRS fold after 2 years when certain investments matured. The problems experienced by us with the DS, were nothing like as bad as many others but issues that just shouldn’t be there or continue to be there during manufacture 3 years after faults were known. For example some faults with welds in the B Pillars which cause constant rattling were first reported back on 2015 and, as of January this year, are still evident in some newly manufactured vehicles. Then there are the oil dilution issues which result in services every 7000 miles rather than 21000 miles. A proven design and engineering fault which LR try to blame on the owners “driving style”

However, it was LRs attitude towards the problems which are out and out design, engineering and manufacture issues that are the main reason the DS went in Feb this year and I am now driving a Lexus. It will take big changes in LRs attitude and that if their arrogant dealerships before I consider returning to LR products

Last edited by Paulcp on Sat Jun 16 2018 10:01am. Edited 2 times in total

My main reason was the lack of a dealer I trusted and no real alternative given that the warranty would return the car to the local dealer. I was prepared to put up with an unreliable car as long as I was looked after.

I recently had an interesting conversation with an ex Land Rover salesman who had moved to another manufacturer. He was quite scathing of land Rover producing new models without fixing the problems on the old ones. He dreaded phone calls because he assumed it would be a complaint from a customer he had sold a car to and said that it was quite normal to have so many cars in for repair that they ran out of loaners.

I moved back to BMW having had two new ones with no issues at all over three years and over 80k miles each. It is fair to say that all has not been rosy with my X5 ( adblue system problems not covered by warranty) but; the dealer does a very good job of being supportive and fixing it. The extended warranty can be bought with an excess making it much cheaper (if you don't need to use it all of the time).

Tim, I think there have been quite a few leave the Green Oval over the last few years.
BC, went down the BMW route, then Disco & Merc.
ADY 555 our moderator moved to a white van (must mind my P & Q's here) Name should be ADY 666.
Jock55 is now an F Pace owner
Muddywheels, well what can I say about the Milk Man
Wilf-- MY2016 HSE D SDV6 - gone due to fuel dilution problems.
fkarim--Not sure if he has moved or not.
So that's half a dozen or so without even thinking. Plus I bet there are quite a lot on the Disco forum.


Me, Still JLR with an F Pace (Built at Lode Lane) Why did I move to a 4 pot...simple...The thought of a £15k bill for a new engine. Plus the cost of a new sport . I did think about a Velar, but again, a lot more money than the F Pace. In Spain - 2018 F Pace - Frightened away from the Sports due to crank failures
Gone - A couple of RRS, A couple of Disco's. However thinking of another Sport.

I think every brand has its issues, some just worse than others. I left BMWs because of the local dealer, I loved the cars but the dealer sucked and it was a 1 hour drive to the next closest. They caused £1000 of damage to my limited edition M3 when they drove it onto the ramp. They parked it in a position to try and hide the damage but I approached the forecourt in a direction few people take and wondered why it was parked facing down hill when normally they face up. I soon figured out why but the service manager wasn’t having any of it until I pointed out the ramps and the damage. That one episode and a few minor issues put me off and I never bought another BMW. I would now however buy another as I live in the East Midlands with a fair choice of dealers to chose from. 2012 5.0 SC AB
Mods:
TPMS
Genuine LR DRLs
Remote Boot close from key fob
2016 Discovery 4 Mirrors AKA RRS2
2014 L405 Surround Camera retro fit (WIP)
2013 RRS Dual View Screen fit (Complete)
2016 LR4 RSE
2014 LR4 Homelink
2016 FFRR Electrochromatic Wing Mirror Glass

70 plate Focus ST (Current)
1942 VEP Ford GPW Jeep (Willys) (Current)
1943 Whites M16 Halftrack (Current)
16 plate Eurofighter Typhoon, 2 x Eurojet engines with 20,000lbs thrust each. 1380mph

Still with JLR with a Velar, even though I was one of the few on here with the snapped crank issue.
I could of gone down the sport route again, but
1/ Had decided on the lower entry / exit of the velar as the swmbo has now got some mobility issues due to illness, and was finding the higher sport (even with the steps) starting to become an issue.
2/ Love the clean sleek look of all the screens etc of the velar (MY18 sport wasn’t out when I was looking),
3/ For the money I was looking at, spec wise I could get the HSE Dynamic with the Windsor leather, heated/cooled/massage seats, etc, basically, autobiography sport spec, so for me an upgrade, even though in theory a lower model if you know what I mean.
4/ I did look at other options,
Merc GLC, just couldn’t get on with the mouse/wheel thing for the screen (too used to a touch screen I presume)
BMW ANY, What can I say, for me I loath the orange of all the dials / buttons, didn’t test drive any so if they’ve changed I doubt I still won’t look as they’re everywhere 🙄
Audi sq5, although I don’t mind the exterior / interior, again like the Merc, lack of touch screen put me off
Tesla Model X, this was a serious contender but, although I loved the tech like that excellent screen, doors that open when you approach and the huge amount of room (6 seat model) etc, 3 things put me off 1/ price, 2/ the electric anxiety thing (range etc), and 3/ just didn’t feel like a £70-110k vehicle (more like the £30-50k bracket) one thing JLR have got right, the feel.
Jag F Pace, just preferred the look of the velar inside and out,

So far only issues with my velar are the occasional screen not playing ball (although only happed twice) and an intermittent rattle from the drivers door, going in to the dealers in a couple of days time, for these issues, so hopefully the latest software update will sort it out, 2015 HSE SDV6 Scotia Grey, ebony / lunar, colour coded, deployable steps, TV, sliding pano and a few other bits. Now gone
2018 Velar R-Dynamic HSE sdv6 silicon silver

SRE wrote:

fkarim--Not sure if he has moved or not.

Not yet. I will however list my reasons for considering a move away from JLR.

In no particular order:

1. Bad press that diesel engined cars are getting is making it really hard for me to go for another one. I do realise that this Euro 6b compliant engine is cleaner than many modern petrols but sadly facts are not relevant here. I am not brave enough to risk owning a JLR PHEV or EV as I don’t trust them to get it right first time (if ever).

2. The prices have now gone well beyond what I can justify (read pockets not deep enough) for something that doesn’t leave the driveway 5 days of most weeks. Yes, we like long distance driving holidays and RRS is the perfect car for the type of trips that we do but that’s only once or max twice a year.

3. While my 3 RRSs comfortably qualified as reliable, the small niggles that I had to get sorted in the current one wasn’t an experience I was expecting when buying a brand new, premium brand. It has been faultless after the minor initial QC issues were rectified in the first few months but I feel I am pushing my luck. 3 good ones is probably the best it can get with LR, statistically speaking While we are lucky that we don’t commute by car and take the tube to work, reliability is still very important as we can do without the hassle of dealership visits while juggling with work.

4. I would like a nice example last of Discovery 4 but not comfortable playing the crankshaft gamble on a car that I am not familiar with the history of, outside manufacturer’s 3 year warranty.

5. Dealership experience, particularly aftersales is shocking for the price.

6. Keeping the current one beyond 3 years of age is something I am seriously considering. Will get an extended warranty of course if I go down that route. Crankshaft issue is still a big worry, although in this case the car has been very well maintained and I know everything about it, having owned it from new. *Could* make it easier to get LR warranty/goodwill behind me if the crankshaft snaps!

7. While I appreciate the car’s off-road ability, it was never something I needed. I have occasionally taken my RRSs off the tarmac but only because I could. Can happily live without it. Is it really worth paying for that capability when I don’t need it? I am no longer worried about performance on snow/ice ... most cars, even RWD ones, cope just fine when proper winter tyres are used, as I witnessed on my ski trips in conditions that get far challenging than anywhere in the UK.

8. I find that currently I am less enthusiastic about cars (in general, not just LR) than I used to be. It’s no longer an actively pursued hobby ( as I only have time & money for one obsession ) so naturally not very keen to pump a lot of money into a quickly depreciating thing. Current: Volvo XC90 T8 Inscription Pro PHEV with some optionals on top
Gone: MY16 RRS2 3.0 SDV6 Autobiography Dynamic, Carpathian Grey & Santorini Black Sliding Pano/Ebony & Ivory 2 Tone
Gone: MY13 RRS 3.0 SDV6 HSE Black Edition, Orkney Grey/Ivory
Gone: MY09 RRS 2.7 TDV6 HSE, Santorini Black/Almond

Well, I think it's all pretty much been said most eloquently by my partners in crime above.

I could have changed for another RRS but was not prepared to loose another £30,000 in depreciation in 3 years and 19,000 miles. A new RRS was going to cost me the old car plus £30,000 and could not justify that sort of money to myself. The crankshaft worries played quite a large part in the decision making. I hope the 4 pot Ingenium 300PSpetrol engine I have selected for the F-Pace will not have similar issues. It is a worry.

I have a rare beast in a JLR dealer that is half way decent, in this part of the world we don't have the choice that others may have. There are 3 major groups here Parks (JLR, Ford, Toyota, Honda, Mazda, Isuzu), Hawco (VW, Audi, Skoda, Seat) and the dreaded Arnold Clark who owns the rest including BMW, Mercedes, Volvo, Renault, Mitsubishi and several other marques. I would rather use my bus pass than buy a car from Arnold! Surprisingly, LR would not give me a very good trade-in price for the RRS (they have dozens of them for sale on their forecourt), but when casually talking to one of the Jag Salesmen in the showroom (the same one as LR!) I was offered an excellent price for the RRS and a good discount on the F-Pace, so it turned from a casual enquiry into a no brainer. The old car plus £8,000. £22,000 cheaper than another RRS (some justified, but there is a huge greed factor in there as well).

F-Pace is due to be delivered at end of August and I will pick it up on 1st September. Will check back in after that time and let you know if it was the right thing to do or not. Meantime I have been lurking on the F-Pace Forum and bumped into SRE whilst there. There are several others there too.

Happy Motoring!

Jock 2018 (MY19) Jaguar F-Pace R-Sport 300PS Petrol in Caesium Blue with many bells and whistles.
2015 RRS HSE SDV6 Firenze Red with Santorini Panoramic Glass Roof, gone but not forgotten.

I left in late 2011 as a result of a pending redundancy. I ended up avoiding that situation and after a 2000 mile move to Perth I went to 3x BMW. X5, X6, M3. Latterly, I had a great combination of L320 and M3 but downsizing to an inner city suburb meant 1 car due to space.

I do think that JLR products are ridiculously expensive selling on a wave of status driven desirability. I do see a lowering of materials and build quality with the L494. The SC is a beast but I also like the diesel.

My LR dealer and Service Department have been truly excellent so far. The local BMW dealer was also very good in spite of damaging my wife’s Mini which they fixed.

So for me, poor service won’t be a deciding factor, but my next car will be my last before I buy my retirement car so I will buy the fastest car I can afford.

When I chose the new car a Disco5 was high up in the running but costs and it been base spec ruled it out at the start, likewise diesels bad press, a RRS was never going to happen as affordability would mean crankshaft roulette and I wouldn’t be able to afford a costly fix myself as a new one was well beyond my means

Over the years I’ve seen prices rise and there was no way I was going to pay £50- £70k on a LR with a decent spec

I miss the brand, I was lucky with my last one as it had zero real isssues, I had a good dealer realationship

F-Pace is due to be delivered at end of August and I will pick it up on 1st September. Will check back in after that time and let you know if it was the right thing to do or not. Meantime I have been lurking on the F-Pace Forum and bumped into SRE whilst there. There are several others there too.

Happy Motoring!

Jock[/quote]

F Pace is different, but a great car, mine is a 4 pot auto, however performance is pretty good and handles far far better than my Sport. Plus it drinks a lot less go-go juice. However the F Pace forum needs a shake up, maybe when you get you new cat we can wake them up a tad  In Spain - 2018 F Pace - Frightened away from the Sports due to crank failures
Gone - A couple of RRS, A couple of Disco's. However thinking of another Sport.

Last edited by SRE on Sun Jun 17 2018 1:37pm. Edited 1 time in total

Although I love Range Rover and Range Rover Sport and after owning 8 of them over the last 16 years , it was simply the crankshaft issue and Landrovers attitude to it that caused me to leave the brand . I was very dubious about moving to BMW but I bit the bullet and bought a nearly new very highly specced X5 M50D and really love it .

I have a Nissan Qashqai thing for the week. Decent car, loads of toys

Top spec, with every box ticked, came out at £38k...

Equivalent DS/Evoque was £10k more

Dealer attitude is another big issue I have with them...

Well I’m reading this at the side of the road waiting for Land Rover assist, as my brand new replacement engine has lost its coolant and is overheating. This is the second roadside breakdown in 3 months after my engine seized. Just called my wife and she said “get rid of it”....

Shame, I love this car, but I am losing confidence in it.

So after 2 x Range Rover Classics, a Freelander 2, a Defender, and a Discovery 4 - none of which ever had any issues - I think I am done with the brand.

Qashquai Mikey....... WooooHooooo, go for it Mike! :thumbsup: 2018 (MY19) Jaguar F-Pace R-Sport 300PS Petrol in Caesium Blue with many bells and whistles.
2015 RRS HSE SDV6 Firenze Red with Santorini Panoramic Glass Roof, gone but not forgotten.