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wilf



Member Since: 08 Nov 2012
Location: on the naughty step
Posts: 759

Range to "oil service required" plummets

I spotted the "range to oil service" was plummeting on my MY16 RRS, shortly after the last service 4.5k miles ago.

It sat at 5k for a couple of weeks, then suddenly dropped to zero at the end of last week and I got the "service required" messages.

My usage pattern has not changed since I bought the car (it quite happily did 16k miles for the first service and 32k for the second). I have done a few long distance trips since the second service, and my usual commute (not urban) is c25 miles. Mileage now is 36.5k.

There is a JLR "Service Compliance Notification" out (ref JLRP00100) that shows how MY 16 - 17 vehicles fitted with Ingenium 2.0 diesels or the 3.0V6 diesel have a problem - allegedly to do with oil dilution by fuel due to a DPF regen issue. Worth a read.

Not just RR Sports then, but Jag XEs, X260 XFs, and F Paces, too. Also Disco Sports and Ewoks.

Called my local Dealer - can't get it in until Jan 18th, they insisted it was safe to continue to drive without fear of engine damage - " a software problem sir".

I will draw off a sample and see if it smells of fuel today. I haven't noticed any drop in mpg, so doubt there have been multiple failed regens. If it does smell of fuel I will call LR Assist. (it didn't so I didn't)

NB - the service bulletin recommends free oil and filter changes for MY 16 - 17 vehicles if the car has done less than 75% of the "recommended service interval" mileage, and ditto with a charged full service if >90%.

I am concerned that this won't get sorted by a simple software update, as the service bulletin seems to indicate that JLR have decided DPF regens take longer on 3.0V6 diesels, with greater periods/amounts of exhaust stroke fuel injection, and the need for more frequent oil/filter changes will be a permanent feature.

AdBlue mileage is unaffected - lots of range yet.

We'll see. MY2016 HSE D SDV6

By the age of 50 you have the face you deserve - George Orwell.

Post #544707 Wed Jan 03 2018 9:08pm
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riverblanche



Member Since: 11 Jun 2011
Location: Retford'ish
Posts: 508

United Kingdom 

I have only just got pasted watching for the DEF to Start going down Laughing

happy to say the oil service counter has been steadily going down, no where near the low miles we actually do, but the miles should be near by the end of March when it is due on time.

it must have dropped 4000 when we have only done about 1500 miles

Thumbs Up Corris HSE Dynamic 2016

Always pick up stick in the middle !!

Post #544710 Wed Jan 03 2018 9:25pm
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wilf



Member Since: 08 Nov 2012
Location: on the naughty step
Posts: 759

This car must be female, it changes it's mind so often. Noticed the "service required" reminder had disappeared this morning, checked the "range to oil service" and it has gone up to 3500 miles!

Who wrote this software, Mickey Mouse? MY2016 HSE D SDV6

By the age of 50 you have the face you deserve - George Orwell.

Post #545571 Thu Jan 11 2018 10:13pm
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Paulcp



Member Since: 18 Apr 2013
Location: Suffolk
Posts: 296

2013 Range Rover Sport SDV6 HSE Atacama Sand

Have a read through the "Service Interval" and "Oil analysis " on this section of the DS forum

https://www.discosportforums.co.uk/viewforum.php?f=17

Only affects certain models of the 2.0 Ingenium and 3.0v6d and is all down to a massive design cock up by LR. Plenty of info on there to show what the design cock up is.

Post #545661 Fri Jan 12 2018 5:06pm
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wilf



Member Since: 08 Nov 2012
Location: on the naughty step
Posts: 759

Wow

198 pages on that first thread, never going to have the time to wade through that! MY2016 HSE D SDV6

By the age of 50 you have the face you deserve - George Orwell.

Post #545781 Sun Jan 14 2018 9:05am
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wilf



Member Since: 08 Nov 2012
Location: on the naughty step
Posts: 759

Well, a software update (even though it had three last August to supposedly cure this issue) - to do with the instrument cluster I understand (waiting for the paperwork to see what it was).

Oil allegedly tested for fuel dilution and pronounced OK, so not changed.,

I have my own sample being tested independently................ MY2016 HSE D SDV6

By the age of 50 you have the face you deserve - George Orwell.

Post #546386 Sat Jan 20 2018 10:43pm
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RRSTDV8



Member Since: 13 Aug 2011
Location: Northamptonshire
Posts: 5689

United Kingdom 2008 Range Rover Sport TDV8 HSE Stornoway Grey

From a quick flick through those threads, it appears that JLR's response is to update the diesel dilution algorithm so it doesn't flag up an oil change so often. Sounds like the same attitude from other issues - the engines will almost certainly survive to 3 years and then fall out of JLR's warranty responsibility and in to the hands of third parties. Third parties will, presumably, find ways to avoid paying for engine failures caused by oil dilution. The result: JLR owners left high and dry.

One wonders how many years it will be before JLR is known for really problematic engines in the way they used to be known for bad electrics. Short termism by corporate big shots... 2012 SDV6 - it's missing a couple of cylinders
2008 TDV8 - it was a labour of love and is much missed

Post #546403 Sun Jan 21 2018 11:18am
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Paulcp



Member Since: 18 Apr 2013
Location: Suffolk
Posts: 296

2013 Range Rover Sport SDV6 HSE Atacama Sand

@RRSTDV8, you've got it spot on

@wilf, you've done the right thing getting an independent oil test. Too many reports on the DS forum of dealers refusal to accept the situation and perform an oil change even though LR are picking up the bill

I bought a DS in Sept 2016, minimum distance driven is not less than 20 miles per journey and I do quite a few 400 mile return trips. LR try to tell me that the reason why I needed an oil change due to oil dilution every 7500 miles was down to my "driving style" but can't tell me what "driving style" is acceptable. No response when I mentioned misleading statements in their brochure and mis-selling of 21000 mile service intervals.

DS was sold last week before residuals drop to GM levels and, after the problems LR caused me with the previous RRS, it is likely to be my last LR product for some time. At least whilst they continue to demonstrate contempt towards customers.

Post #546452 Sun Jan 21 2018 9:47pm
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wilf



Member Since: 08 Nov 2012
Location: on the naughty step
Posts: 759

Update.

My Millers Oils lab report came back.

8.5% fuel dilution! That means the oil is well out of viscosity spec, Millers quote 4% as the danger level at which oil should be immediately changed.

And the Dealer had told me it was OK. Told me their own Fuel dilution check showed no problem (Bet that was a calculated one, not actually measured, I am going to press to find out). A very sharp 'phone call resulted this afternoon, and it is going in early tomorrow for an immediate oil and filter change .

I am very unhappy with the dealer as they point blank refused to accept there was a problem until I blew my top, even after I quoted JLRP00100, whose instructions they failed to follow by not changing the oil last week.

How the heck did it get that much fuel in it in just 6k miles from the last oil change? And how is it not going to happen again? My driving pattern has not changed, my daily commute is 25 miles each way of fast A/B roads, not an urban crawl. I have over 150k miles of using these 3.0 V6 diesels, including 80k miles in DFP equipped ones, never had an issue before.

I can see me having an account with the oil analysis lab. Wonder how many other cars are out there with dangerous fuel dilution levels? MY2016 HSE D SDV6

By the age of 50 you have the face you deserve - George Orwell.

Post #546688 Wed Jan 24 2018 9:33pm
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SingeRRS



Member Since: 22 Sep 2009
Location: Garage
Posts: 127

United Kingdom 2011 Range Rover Sport 3.0 TDV6 HSE Stornoway Grey

Thousands - see https://www.discosportforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=5379. More in D5 and Ewok forums.

After twenty years and a mix of Freelanders, Discos, Sports and my final FFRR I’m off - had enough of the faults, dealers who are incompetent, lazy and untruthful and ‘couldn’t care less’ attitude of LR. Their products are now over designed and under engineered - what a time to pioneer a new engine design and plant as the car world moves to hybrids and batteries - a colossal strategic error.

Sorry to hijack the thread. Tesla MX ordered and my last LR product is traded in.

Good luck to all with LR. I live in hope they will change tack and realise the error of their short term approach.

Post #546703 Thu Jan 25 2018 12:00am
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Stevepd



Member Since: 22 May 2017
Location: Warminster
Posts: 205

United Kingdom 2006 Range Rover Sport TDV6 HSE Cairns Blue

wilf wrote:
Update.

My Millers Oils lab report came back.

8.5% fuel dilution! That means the oil is well out of viscosity spec, Millers quote 4% as the danger level at which oil should be immediately changed.


And to think how many are out there that will only get serviced when indicated but don't reason with the accelerated count down, then they'll into the 2nd hand market in a few years with tired/compromised engines?

Steve. 2006 2.7 TDV6 HSE in Cairns Blue, Quantum remap.

Post #546705 Thu Jan 25 2018 9:36am
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Paulcp



Member Since: 18 Apr 2013
Location: Suffolk
Posts: 296

2013 Range Rover Sport SDV6 HSE Atacama Sand

This is partly a consequence of the oil dilution and partly poor quality parts. Can affect all 2.0d Ingenium engines including RRS, Velar and Jags in addition to the DS
Quite a few DS and Evoque owners have had to have new complete engines as a consequence

Apologies for the quality of the picture, use this link for a clearer copy
https://www.discosportforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=7555

Land Rover quality control anyone?

Post #546712 Thu Jan 25 2018 11:26am
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wilf



Member Since: 08 Nov 2012
Location: on the naughty step
Posts: 759

So - this morning I asked exactly how this dealer decided the oil did not need changing last week.

They said "from the diagnostic read out sir, it indicated oil dilution well within limits"

So when I then asked why, since the same system had called for an oil service just 5000 miles after the last service, based upon that same calculated oil dilution figure, it suddenly decided everything was OK while in their workshop? All went quiet.............

I hate being lied to. MY2016 HSE D SDV6

By the age of 50 you have the face you deserve - George Orwell.


Last edited by wilf on Thu Jan 25 2018 3:41pm. Edited 1 time in total

Post #546721 Thu Jan 25 2018 1:57pm
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Paulcp



Member Since: 18 Apr 2013
Location: Suffolk
Posts: 296

2013 Range Rover Sport SDV6 HSE Atacama Sand

@wilf
From our experience, and that of others on the DS forum, the Millers readings for oil dilution actually come out lower than the dealers readings on the diagnostics.
Is it possible that they didn't actually change the oil at all on the last service!

Post #546724 Thu Jan 25 2018 2:52pm
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wilf



Member Since: 08 Nov 2012
Location: on the naughty step
Posts: 759

It IS possible, but I don't care to contemplate that thought. MY2016 HSE D SDV6

By the age of 50 you have the face you deserve - George Orwell.

Post #546726 Thu Jan 25 2018 3:38pm
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